as can be seen, I have been vocal about this for years. it is mildly surprising that this is and has not been mentioned much publically. it is possible that I can be scolded for not having mentioned this earlier, but that would only be done by people who have not listened. rather like the Jimmy Saville, Gary Glitter or Rolf Harris 'revelations', nobody would believe it, but everyone knew.
these people are dead. I knew both of them, reasonably well, but before they became the entity they call Coil.
the people that knew them have never spoken out, and for this, they should feel shame. I was always greeted with incredulity, and always with the adjunction that I wasn't part of their little clique, so I couldn't possibly know. but I did.
no, I have never been a 'joiner.' not ever to such a patently corrupt and disgrace to humanity as these people. forget any of the sounds that these people produced. they deserve no excuses. perversion stems from a total impropriation and neglect of basic human values, and as such, is worthy of pity and treatment. these unfortunate individuals had access to nobody that would call them out; in Sleazy's case, he was simply too rich and powerful, and in Geff/Jhon/whatever's case, he was a mess.
and they are not the only ones. the whole history of the 'industrial movement' is littered with such basket cases, and the real culprits are yet to be outed.
Thank you. Perhaps you can enlighten your readers with the further explanation regarding PTV, CV, C93, NWW, Whitehouse, Clock DVA and others. Who is pure enough, whom to avoid?
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure that the problem is just who is enough pure or not. As a victim of that kind of persons, it tooked me 30 years (at least) to understand what happened to me in my childhood and to accept it as a part of my life (and why i have so many questions that no one could answer).
ReplyDeleteA destroyed life in fact. A weekly psychoanalyst, to simply support that kind of things which never quit you, never. You live everyday with it.
But, thank you, a huge, a never ending "thank you" to artists (not all) that gave to me, a light, through their music/sound and helped me to feel better (even if this kind of feeling is difficult and strange to understand for the artist).
Believe it or not, i always had a strange feeling when i listened "coil". Even one night, before i received an ordered coil cd, i dreamed of a rain of human skeletons... Our unconscious knows better than us what to know about what we do no want to know. I do not listen their music anymore since many years. Today, i know the "why" and "how" of this strange feeling.
I once have a girlfriend who was abused as teenager, her life wasn't the same after that.
ReplyDeletethe reason I wrote about this, is that it was publicly posted referencing me. I want to make sure that at least one mention existed acknowledging this, and putting it on record that what I say is based on knowledge of the people involved personally. I cannot make such claims with regards to, say, Gary Glitter.
ReplyDeletesecondly, these people acted on others in the world; this is not someone collecting pictures - which is bad enough, I would say - but actually carrying out operations directly, physically impinging on others.
for the rest: the time in which most of the 'industrial' (in the UK sense of the word - not the later use in the USA and elsewhere of the label) was befuddled with the attraction to the forbidden and the dark. this was partly due to one of the major laws of influence; that of scarcity, and as I have seen many times in my life, what people cannot get is all the more desirable and compelling for that. some people were simply manipulated by that force. some were, as I also know from personal experience and contact, drawn to such things because of damage in their early years. some people wished to, as a furtherance of the deliberate provocation fostered by punk, simply be 'naughty,' as as with Sid's swastika T-shirt earlier. Joy Division and then New Order; the TG symbol which was also used by David Bowie, which was originally Oswald Mosely's British Fascist Party's symbol; Spandau Ballet and Simple Minds; all of these and many, many more 'flirting' with things that they did not have a true understanding of, in many (but not all) cases. this list is very, very long, of *highly* questionable affiliations, references and hidden agendas in the ranks of the Industrial and affiliated groups. I have had several conversations over the years with people who publish books about actually listing and naming all of this; for, incredibly enough, it seems that I have a very good memory of these 'goings on' from this period, in contrast with the relatively recent beginnings of the writing of this particular part of cultural history - "England's Hidden Reverse" and "Wreckers of Civilisation" being the two examples that spring to mind, both of which contain many instances of Just Plain Untrue stories told by people who were either not born when the events took place, or not present, or actually not able to remember large amounts of the years involved at all due to various substance abuse scenarios.
much of this, I will say, is/was regrettable and simply adolescent stupidity. a lot of it, as yet undocumented, is rather more serious.
Thank you for the clarification of these important matters. The situation is indeed serious, but also complicated and ambiguous. There's just one example: Skinny Puppy being that dreadful quite successfully fought against vivisection and animal testing. Many people still consume the Industrial music products attracted by either their darkness or romanticism. While the latter is not that bad, the worst is when the listeners participate in some truly evil sound rituals of which they do not aware. It would be great to hear/read the stories from the kitchen of this large movement from those who was involved in it and have enough wisdom now to reflect it. "The true history of Industrial' could save some young souls from going into darkness without any light…
ReplyDelete"and they are not the only ones. the whole history of the 'industrial movement' is littered with such basket cases, and the real culprits are yet to be outed."
ReplyDeleteThis presupposes that there is a movement out there made by ANGELS...so you can listen guilt-free....
The simplistic conflation of message and messenger. According to this logic you can stop listening to music altogether...because if it was possible to know about every aspect of the personal life of an artist it's very likely you will find something unpleasant or disagreeable.
So what if those behind Coil and The Hafler Trio are really nasty people. What difference does it make in the life of anyone whose only contact with these people is through their audio-visual output. And who will care and what will matter when both the abuser and the abused are dead.
I actually have no interest in their "output." I am simply concerned that those that deliberately commit acts against others which cause harm should be brought to account, and history should not be allowed to have these facts left out.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDelete"evidence" according to whom? yes, I do, but I doubt you would accept it as such. "indulging?" yes, just as you are. "habit?" no. not regularly or enough for that. I, and others, said these things you refer to as "slinging shit" about these people ("etc") - and more - while they were alive. repeatedly. I have no problem with people "distancing themselves," but you have no way of knowing or judging whether my life is "shit" or otherwise. thank you for your spirited contribution, regardless of its not being informed by other than rumour and conjecture itself.
ReplyDelete